Ok Heres another idea to get the Cat to land on water

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Author	Topic: Ok Heres another idea to get the Cat to land on water
Snake Pilot	posted 11-06- 05:32 PM Ok seeing as there are many new terrains out would it be possible to make a terrain with no water? Make some very flat areas and texture them as water and then let the Catalina land on that. You'd have to do some work on making it look real, ie. floating under and ontop of the water but its better than trying to change the 'world.' This way you could make ships drivable like the Sherman or Tiger. So basically to get a/c to land on water, get rid of the water and make it something your able to land on. Any suggestions? Snake IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-06- 05:47 PM Hmmmm..... The problem I see then is that any plane could land there..... Also the Cat needs to be able to sink enough so that it doesnt look like she is on her gears.... So far the one with the most promise is the one by wt if we can figure out what causes the splashing..... Also it may be that this version of the Cat reacts to water differently than the first one he tried. (not that there has been any breakthrough, jut that it is actually a 100% different plane...) Nice try though and it did poit out to me the reason we are have so much trouble.... CATS DON'T LIKE WATER! Sorry, been workin on her all day and getting a little silly... ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
ArgonV Pilot	posted 11-06- 06:21 PM Well Snickers, I guess its time for your project to do a species change 'cause dogs love water! IP: Logged
Snake Pilot	posted 11-09- 02:49 PM I knew that all a/c would be able to land on it but what if yous just made the are near a harbour or an island hard? Then you could splash ships at sea and stuff. Snake IP: Logged
wakeup tailgunner Pilot	posted 11-09- 04:15 PM I have already got something similar. It is a coral atoll, with a circular reef. The 'water' inside is solid, and raised fractionally over the water level. I wanted to put a water layer over the top of this to make the splashes, that's where the trouble started. Chief issues were horrible reactions to wheels, no starting from the ground, takeoff problems, and a continual water fountain all the time. This water fountain was fatal to the crew....the water splashes through the plane, and 'drowns' the pilot. One thing I thought to try was to make a water LOD under the plane that would make a splash. It would also need adjustments to the body points. No reason why it can't work, it just isn't a real solution. If nothing else works, I have it as a standby! IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-09- 10:07 PM wt - you more than anyone else (besides me ) know the state of the Cat. Whatever can be done to make this possible should be done even if its a hack (I wish there were a way to make this happen on the default terrain...). Please tell me that there is a way we can use the PBY lagoon in the Pacific terrain.... Even MSFS and MSCFS overlook the ability of planes to land on water (you have to turn off crashes before you can do it...) I have a very nice model of a Boeing model 314 - the "Dixie Clipper" (type used in Indina Jones 1st movie) In MSFS she looks great starting out by SFO or by the SF waterfront parked next to a pier... But nothing beats the Cat. She is beautiful seductive and habit forming (ask wt, he was going to do the tail only and has done the entire 1st level LOD!!!!! Or Madmoe who has done more research on this plane that he did in all of high school and still continues to find gems!). (I am sure others feal the same way about their favorite plane but it needed to be said . MH or Mighty, - In the next incarnation of an OpenPlane flight sim, if at all possible allow for water landings. There are so many planes besides the Cat, and this is such an over looked area. Everytime I make a major change to the TeamPBY website, someone from InertiaGames.com visits. Thanks for stopping by and thanks for still paying attention. ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
jedi Pilot	posted 11-13- 10:45 AM I really think this may only be solvable by the "terrain gurus." Is it possible to make a terrain where there is "ground" a few feet below the water? If so, you can make a really strong "fuselage bottom" and "pontoon bottoms" that will rest on the ground underneath the water surface. You might not survive multiple landings, but a single takeoff and landing might work. I think the Cat already "sinks" instead of blowing up, right? If there were something for it to sink onto that might work. The only other idea I have is really a question: Why don't the ships "sink" or take damage? You can create a DOF so that ships will appear to travel along the surface--why don't they explode or sink? Could you add a "ship object" to the bottom of a seaplane? Would SDOE go crazy if you did? ------------------ --jedi-- IP: Logged
ArgonV Pilot	posted 11-13- 11:00 AM Hmmm... ships dont sink cause they have no inertia or weight. Actually... with the obBodyPts in place on the PBY, she now does blow up on contact with the water. (Im sure theres a way to get around this) Adding a ship to the bottom of the PBY, well this has a very slim chance of working. The ship would be a child of the PBY and the PBY already has inertia and weight... so that could present a problem. IP: Logged
Pye Pilot	posted 11-13- 01:51 PM can the BMY land on the carrier! if so Can you raise the deck of the aircraft carrier object, to the ground (sea level or below!) and land on that! I read Nats ship has hull under the water! could he make a really low and long ship! just under the water! IP: Logged
wakeup tailgunner Pilot	posted 11-13- 03:03 PM Making a flat strip of water coloured land is easy. Trouble is, it doesn't look any good at all. You need to drop the wheels, and there would be no splashes or wake. Also, any plane could land there. oh well IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-13- 03:53 PM My brain has had too much of this one.... I think I'll sit on the sideline, nod every now and then, and grin like the village idiot... (No one would notice the differance anyway... ) I will keep my fingers crossed that someone can work something out..... ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
Nat Pilot	posted 11-13- 05:49 PM and because I'm one of those "terrain guru's" lol I don't even get involved cause I really do know the futility of this one, we want it, but simply can't have it without changes we aren't willing to accept, the simple truth of the matter as the game code stands, is that you simply cannot land and come to a stop on water, it requiers code changes that I have no idea about but am guessing aren't that simple. Really sorry guys, but this just isn't going to have a happy ending. I'll run through a few points, they have been mentioned before, but they are worth pointing out. 1. Putting a land terrian one or two feet under the surface of water tiles is easy, and yes, this will allow you to "land" on water, problem: Water splashes, they wreck your aircraft, kill the pilots, and generally wreak havoc, even when stopped the water spouts carry on until you're destroyed, I'm of the opinion these are due to the tires, although hidden, they are bouncing on the water via the spring dof causing the whole aircraft to bounce and create their own water spouts, the damage becomes exponential. 2. you need intertia to move and fly, inertia makes you sink I'm sure there are other points, but those 2 are the main ones I guess. ~Nat~ IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-13- 07:32 PM From what I understand it (code changes) basically involve creating a different type of damage media, and probably a class to go exclude certain vehicles from being damaged by it.... Ideally, the water would not pass through the hull unless it was breached. One of the most common reasons for a water crash is a hot landing. (You come down so hard that the impact pops rivets from the hull. Thats not the fast killer though. Come down wrong and it tears apart the front gear doors, forcing water in the the sealed compartment beyond. Now you are nose heavy. If you are going faster still, it will the force water into the main compartment of the plane and tear it apart catastrophically (sp) ... Once this process started, you were very lucky to stop it.... (This still happens today with the ones that have been converted to water tankers...) ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
wakeup tailgunner Pilot	posted 11-14- 04:20 PM Nat's right about the tyres. They bounce so hard sometimes, they can turn over a plane. The thing I am trying to work out, is whether some of the other materials like ICE have a slippery surface. Why use wheels at all if you can have a hull and land made of slippery materials that will allow a belly landing and a belly takeoff! The other problem of the pilot getting killed is a tricky one though. In theory, though, there is no reason I can think of not to just make the pilot unkillable. IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-14- 05:04 PM Except for the splashing, that is easy, he sits above the water line. Problem is with the splashing. Was it ever determined what causes that? (What caused the 109 to create a geyser when it crashed?) I suspect the geysers of water might be able to be overcome. (If you can fall off a carrier and not create the geysers, what is different?) ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-15- 11:11 AM Hey wt - Have your tried playing around with the spring values in the dofs for the struts in the tires? Mayby this will make them bounce less violently.... ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged
wakeup tailgunner Pilot	posted 11-15- 12:22 PM It isn't the wheel struts doing the bouncing! Speaking as an experienced crasher.... If you 'prang the old kite in the drink' so to speak, and a wheel is detached, it can be seen bouncing away for some time...... To test this, drop the gear and dive in! I believe it is due to the inherent material property of 'rubber' which is bouncy. That would make sense when you think about it. The materials should broadly speaking act as they are described.... Concrete....ice...grass...etc This was why I wanted to find out if ICE was slippery. A surface made of slippery ice could be used as a runway without wheels. This is crucial if water is sitting over the top. Then, all we have to worry about is the ornamental water fountain..... IP: Logged
jedi Pilot	posted 11-15- 02:57 PM Just a few observations... I can "ditch" a fighter, and it will bounce off the water several times. I can also taxi the Corsair (which has a "beefed-up" fuselage to allow the damage model to activate the features rather than always blowing up) off the carrier into the water, and it will NOT blow up, but simply sinks. That means there is some combination of speed and strength that produces the "terminal" damage. The Cat need not have "wheels" in the water at all, if its fuselage and pontoons are strong enough to survive the ditching itself. Since its wings are high-mounted, there is no reason why it should necessarily shed parts during the "ditching" either. Once it sinks tho, it's sunk If there's a way to prevent it sinking, I bet we can make it strong enough to survive the ditching. ------------------ --jedi-- IP: Logged
Snickers Pilot	posted 11-15- 03:58 PM In the 1st prototype of the Cat, I took off from Mainz, landed on the lake, and taxied all the way across (if you want to call ~70mhp taxing) and took off, circled back and landed at Maintz. Damage was not the problem. The problem is with sinking. This is the brick wall that has been run into time and again by people who know OpenPlane better than I (though I doubt they are as stubborn as I ) It takes a long time for me to admit defeat, and I am not there yet, but the time she's a comin'.... Overcome this wall, and you have created an entirely new game. Now you can build actual fleets and man them against the attacking aircraft while trying to get to your target... (Imagine the Bismark getting close enough to shell Eastbourne.....). Like I said, a completely different game. In all seriousness, I don't think you will see it happen without changes to the code.... (though I still hold hope for special features in new terrains...) Also, this issue has been raised enough (by more than just myself) that hopefully MH & Co. will see fit to include this type of action in a future version.... (MH - would it help if I slipped you a 20? ) ------------------ Snickers =FC= IP: Logged

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