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Author	Topic: Cause of MAX Shading problems
Bryan Russell Pilot	posted 04-17- 08:20 PM Well I think it is anyway. It looks as if the MAX2OBJ plugin is screwing vert normals. Every time I export, without any changes at all to the model, the shading is different. I don't know if this is fixed in the newest version of the MAX2OBJ as it doesn't work, or even show up in r2.5. Does anyone know if it works OK for MAXr3? I used another OBJ plugin, and the shading came out spot on every time, well at least it was smooth across the objects. The plugin is from a guy called Johnny Ow, sorry I have no idea where I got it from. The only problem with this plugin is that it doesn't support the material file so that the textures and colours may take a hit. It should be easy enough to manually edit the OBJ file and add materials for objects that use only one texture but multitexture object could be a problem. BTW this one also appears to support true polygons and will automatically correct non-convex polys. So, if the r3 version of MAX2OBJ doesn't work the alternative is to: a) Ask the habware guy nicely to fix it, and make one for r2.5 as well. MAX2OBJ is very good except for these little probs. b) Ask Johnny Ow (whoever he is) if he will add material support. c) Implement VRML import in OPS. I found a VRML parsing library so I'll take a look at option (c), and also try to track Johnny Ow down. Spanky, you seem to have contact with the habware bloke so can you talk to him? Bryan IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-17- 08:23 PM Johnny Ow frequently answers questions over at the support.discreet.com forums. I'm sure if you make a post about this over there, he will respond. Heck, maybe I will too. I would LOVE to be able to export polygons more complex than quads finally. IP: Logged
DanW Pilot	posted 04-17- 09:27 PM I thought MAX2OBJ for 2.5 works...it works for me. But maybe that is why we keep getting abnormal shading problems in the fuselage and tail section. As soon as you split them up, they wind up having different shading. IP: Logged
Tailslide Pilot	posted 04-17- 10:05 PM I don't know if it's vertex normals Bryan.. if you look way back I did some playing around with the rudder from my yak and posted the results. The new plugin for R3 still has problems, I vote for VRML. TS IP: Logged
Bryan Russell Pilot	posted 04-17- 11:59 PM All I know is that I tried every trick in the book to try and get the shading right, and it was different every export. The Export/import/weld/smooth etc etc seemed to work for me (not totally but OK) for the first export but the next time I exported it would be screwed again. When I used Johnny Ows exporter it worked every time, only it messed up some of the textures/colours. IP: Logged
Tailslide Pilot	posted 04-18- 12:14 AM When I poked around in the files it appeared max2obj was re-ordering the faces. He tried to fix it but I haven't dug into the files on the new version to see whats different from the old one. TS IP: Logged
Bryan Russell Pilot	posted 04-18- 01:01 AM TS, You have Max2r5 right? I couldn't get the new version of OBJ2MAX working on mine. Can you send it to me if you did? IP: Logged
Spanky the Mad Dog Pilot	posted 04-18- 02:13 AM Spanky here.. Yeah i was in contact with him and he hasn't answered my last email. Did you guys all try the newer r3 one he sent me that i gave out? If its not working. How hard is it to make a new one? it might be the best choice. Sometimes ya just have to do it yourself right? IP: Logged
Spanky the Mad Dog Pilot	posted 04-18- 06:24 AM Spanky here.. K I will email hab again if you guys can give me clear and consise stuff i can give him anything he would need to fix it What is it doing wrong and what do you want or want fixed? Exactly and no links cause he may not have time to check them. IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-18- 09:40 AM Bryan, I couldn't get the new Max2Obj to work either. I just assumed it was for Max 3.0 and wouldn't work for me since I have Max 2.5. Spanky, See if you can get Hab to work on the polygon export feature. IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-18- 09:43 AM Bryan, Can you email me the Johnny Ow plugin? Thanks! jtrivelli@adelphia.net IP: Logged
Tailslide Pilot	posted 04-18- 10:21 AM Bryan, I have Max r3. IP: Logged
Spanky the Mad Dog Pilot	posted 04-18- 12:20 PM SPanky here.. JT i need more detail then that. Tell me exactly what the plug in is doing wrong and exactly what it doesn't do at all. And if you can how to reproduce those problems. IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-18- 02:04 PM Ok... in the export dialogue, you can select to export as either triangles, quads, or polygons. Triangles and quads works fine, but if you select polygons it still only exports as triangles and quads... it should be able to create polygons more complex than quads. I've talked to him about this.... he said it's a known problem, but didn't say when it would be fixed. Perhaps he'll be more motivated to fix it if he sees that many of us are using his plugin :-) I have a feeling that fixing it will not be a trivial matter, however. [This message has been edited by JT (edited 04-18-2000).] IP: Logged
Spanky the Mad Dog Pilot	posted 04-18- 02:16 PM Spanky here... Ok i'll see what he says boys. Have you tried the newest plugin JT? the one he gave me that was tweaked a bit? IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-18- 04:27 PM Yeah, didn't work at all. The option to export OBJ just plain disappears from the export menu when I load that. IP: Logged
Tailslide Pilot	posted 04-18- 06:32 PM It only works under max r3 JT. I tried it and still had the flashing polygon problem. TS ------------------ Patch It! TS Aircombat IP: Logged
Bryan Russell Pilot	posted 04-18- 07:57 PM I'll send the file tonight JT. Just keep in mind that the Materials don't work. Should be able to manually edit for one texture per object cases though. I suspected that the new MAX2OBJ was r3, oh well it doesn't look like the goods anyway. I'm about 1/2 way through doing the VRML97 OPS plugin now so unless there is a major problem with MAX's VRML97 exporter then it should be the goer. Shouldn't be any issues, it is a 'factory' plugin after all. The good news JT is that it has lots of options for exporting as tri, quad, ngon and also based on visible edges. Also translation and rotation info is right in the format (although they could have made the rotation stuff alittle easier for me!) so it won't need any of the dodgey's I did for OBJ. I think it also supports heirarchy, which might be useful. Spanky: For the shading thing on the OBJ2MAX plugin, I don't know for sure but one thing is that the vertex normals aren't unit length and it's also possible that the vertex normals are not ordered correctly. IP: Logged
JT Pilot	posted 04-18- 10:07 PM Thanks, Byran... I eagerly await the files. Good luck on your work with VRML format. IP: Logged
Tailslide Pilot	posted 04-19- 01:07 PM A cool bonus to this is that aircraft maker program writes out vrml files. Could be an easy way for people who are not comfortable with modelling to get planes into the game. TS IP: Logged
Nat Pilot	posted 04-22- 08:32 AM well, this is all kinda sad.. now that I've finally set Max right for the exports (I was loosing textures before) now I have this problem... I created that volcano/mountain, and yes, I get this shading bug, it looks more like the interior on the volcano is showing through to the outside, whats worse, I use Max2, I'm not sure what version I have of obj2max max2obj, but by the sounds of things this isn't going to make much difference as the newest version wont work for me anyway. So I'm left with doing the best I can for now, and patiently anticipating Bryans VRML plugin.. and maybe searching the net for a obj plugin in the meantime. Bryan, talking about OPS, I know you're looking at updating OPS, it would be a big help if you could define a key stroke for zoom in zoom out, since I'm working on terrain alot now this would really help for working on large objects. ~Nat~ IP: Logged
Bryan Russell Pilot	posted 04-23- 08:35 AM There are already some keys: Z/X for little steps 8/7 for bigger steps and 2/1 for really big steps. OPS is pretty much designed around aircraft for the moment and the view movement, and even part movement stuff doesn't scale well for larger object such as terrain. IP: Logged
Nat Pilot	posted 04-23- 12:14 PM thanks alot Bryan, yeah I know about it being more for "small" objects, but I can use it quiet well for bigger objects, it was only bugging me trying to zoom in and out with the mouse.. lol, this will really help alot know the keys, thanks Bryan ~Nat~ IP: Logged

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