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Author Topic:   The Patriot
Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-05- 06:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just saw the movie "The Patriot" this week-
end. Awesome movie and I'm all fired up. Why
don't you British try to come over here and rule us again? Wouldn't mind having a piece of your ass a second time. Or is it 3rd? The war of 1812 is in there someplace.

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-06- 10:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
err...Smokey.

We almost got our ass kicked in the War of 1812. If I remember correctly, they even torched the capital.

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Spanky the Mad Dog
Pilot
posted 07-06- 03:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Spanky the Mad Dog   Click Here to Email Spanky the Mad Dog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Spanky here...

Actually Dan, I thought you did Lose the 1812 war? I'll Have to do some checking up on that though.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-06- 04:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Actually Dan's right. The war of 1812 was
considered pretty much a draw between America
and Britain. If anyone won it was Canada and
if anyone lost it was the American Indian.
Here's the web page where I got the info if
you're interested: http://members.tripod.com/~war1812/summary.html

[This message has been edited by Smokey (edited 07-06-2000).]

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-06- 08:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What's Canada?

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silas
Pilot
posted 07-06- 09:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for silas   Click Here to Email silas     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What's Canada? eh!

Canada is the best part of North America.

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Spanky the Mad Dog
Pilot
posted 07-07- 02:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Spanky the Mad Dog   Click Here to Email Spanky the Mad Dog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Spanky here...

Yeah I did some surfing after I posted and it seemed like a draw to me too.

Just another huge waste of lives and money.
Funny, that sounds like all wars doesn't it.

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-07- 04:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-07- 04:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sounds like most wars to me. Especially the
following lines from the above web page.

"In summary, the war should never have been fought. It was motivated by merchants and greed. It had little to do with patriotism, or national pride. The US gained nothing in territory, that had not been ceded to it by the Treaty of Paris."

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-07- 06:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Smokey:

Spanky didn't say most wars...he said all wars are a "waste of lives and money". Would you agree that FREEDOM is worth fighting for...even if it costs lives and money...or not?

Spanky is clear, he doesn't think anyone should fight for their freedom. Where do you stand?

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Jaguar
Pilot
posted 07-07- 08:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jaguar   Click Here to Email Jaguar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I just checked my resources, and Silas is right. Canada IS the best part of North America!

Cheers!
Lt. Col. Jaguar

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Nat
Pilot
posted 07-07- 08:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Nat   Click Here to Email Nat     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
lets be very honest about this... back when all that happend the Americas were a long way off, and seemed very unimportant to the King and the nation as a whole. You can't tell me that you honestly believe, that if the King had really wanted to keep the Americas, and deployed the full military might of THE world power at that time (Great Britain) that the farmers running round with guns culd have stoped us? Granted you did defeat the British forces that were there, with a little French help, but really, if GB had really have put it's full weight behind the war, the peasents living in the Americas at the time had little if not no chance to defeat us.

Now don't get me wrong, I aint flaming you, unlike your provocative remarks above, but simply telling you that there was no stronger military force in the world at the time than the British Army, and that if full backing had've been given, the US would still be part of the British Empire today (whats left of it anyway), but the US was a long way fro mthe UK back then, and just far to costly to fully support, and frankly, not worth the trouble at the time, yes put effort in not to lose whats ours, but no, don't pile in the major part of your forces in a war half a world away when France is sat nextdoor to you

I am ofcourse only referring to the war of independance in this post.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-07- 08:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jerry,
I agree, freedom is worth fighting for.
That's why I started this thread after being
inspired by the movie The Patriot. However,
their are way more wars fought over money
and greed than freedom. The only two wars
fought over US freedom was the revolution
and WWII.

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Jerry
Pilot

I am ofcourse only referring to the war of independance in this post.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-07- 08:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Reply w/Quote
Spanky here...

Yeah I did some surfing after I posted and it seemed like a draw to me too.

Just another huge waste of lives and money.
Funny, that sounds like all wars doesn't it.

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-07- 04:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-07- 04:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey    @½÷ngā@¤H @½÷ngā@lt @½÷ngā@¤½·ōngā@%$½·ōngā@¼Ü*½·ōngā@Ģ@+½·ōngā@,š$½·ōngā@ÄŪ*½·ōngā@“ $½·ōngā@Ō$$c¾nōngā@„ø6c¾nōngā@¼¹6c¾nōngā@ģŁ3c¾nōngā@4¹6c¾nōngā@Ģø6c¾nōngā@Tč3A§ ōngā@tu3A§ ōngā@¬@3A§ ōngā@CENTER> posted 07-07- 08:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
...and if we had remained part of the Empire we would have ended up as a 2nd tier country like Canada and Australia and unable to save your ass from the Germans! (Notice I said 2nd tier not 2nd rate!)

Yeah, Canada is the best part of North America. That's why your dollar is so strong and people are risking their lives to sneak into your country.

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-07- 08:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Nat,
I don't know how determined Britain was
because I didn't live back then. Their could
be some truth to your remarks. It seems to
me that the King of England would probably
be pretty pissed when one of his colonys
revolted. In addition he may have been
worried that it could lead to revolt in other
colonies. My guess is He would be very
determined to put the revolt down as soon as
possible which He very nearly did. However
the rabble were able to prolong the situation
and when the French entered the war it was
more that England could handle.

[This message has been edited by Smokey (edited 07-07-2000).]

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-07- 10:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jerry,

You never cease to crack me up. LOL

Don't bash Canada too bad. We get some decent hockey teams from them.

And you British guys, still bitter about U-571? You mean there were other countries present at D-Day? Hmmm..that's odd. I didn't see any other allied units in Saving Private Ryan.

All this Revolutionary War stuff is lame. We won anyway. You 'foreigners' (look, I cant even spell that right) should come to the South and dicuss the Civil War. Now there's some still bitter people I tell you.

Relax people, just fucking with ya'.

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Nat
Pilot
posted 07-08- 05:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Nat   Click Here to Email Nat     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Smokey, I agree with you on all counts, I really think the main problem at the time was purely one of logistics, it's not a simple thing sending troops on mass to the US in sail boats etc, so I do think that even if things had've gone better for the British at the time, the same ending was inevitable, and really not a bad thing in my opinion.

Were not only pissed about U-571, which is a complete mockery of a true WW2 fact, and an insult to the people that actualy "Found" the enigma (it was found, not a planned operation.. an abandond U Boat was boarded and the Enigma was still aboard and intact), but also about the film Titanic, which portrays the 1st officer as a coward and murderer that shot himself in the end, when in all trueth he was hailed as a hero at the time for getting so much organised and so maney ppl off the ship, this mans family are still alive for christs sake!! Now the whole world believes what was shown in the film, and has no idea of the actual facts, now thats fucked up, fuck around with ancient history (like Braveheart which is incorrect in so maney ways) but don't portray a dead hero in this way atleast while his relatives are still living.. damn.. what will be next.. that the US won in Vietanm?? Reckon Hollywood could make billions by re-writing that part of history huh? OK, might sound extreme or foolish.. but the points the same, just on a grander scale.

For me, if you're going to make a film about a historical event, then use historical facts, don't twist them cause you think it will sell more tickets to make it look like the story would be better suited to the US public.

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Jaguar
Pilot
posted 07-08- 12:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jaguar   Click Here to Email Jaguar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I totally agree with you Nat. The only thing that matters in Hollywood is money, not some poor bloke's family. The whole world is like that now. It's amazing what one person will do to another just to make a few bucks........ woah, I haven't ranted for a few months.... that felt good!

Jerry- It doesn't matter how much it's worth, it's the name that matters! I bet your dieing to lay your hands on a loonie or a toonie! Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote


Spanky, please explain the following to a "stupid" old man: "Freedom is worth fighting for" and "All wars are a waste of lives and money". Your logic exceeds my capacity to understand. Are you Vulcan?

Are you saying that Freedom is worth fighting for as long as it doesn't cost lives and money? What is Freedom worth to you Spanky...perhaps a well played non-violent hockey game? Winner take all? Oops! That would cost money...skates aren't free are they. I'll wait for your solution.

Re Canada #1 - well, if the UN said it then it must be true. LOL I see Norway came in second. Who conducted this study...polar bears? Obviously weather wasn't a factor!

The US is in the way of people sneaking into Canada? Hell, we have so many illegal immigrants we'll ship'em to you. Problem is they don't bring parka's with them and don't want to go to Canada. If your ports weren't frozen nine months of the year they could get there by boat!

Besides, why don't we #3 Americans just move north to #1 Canada? I guess we haven't read the UN report. LOL

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Spanky the Mad Dog
Pilot
posted 07-09- 02:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Spanky the Mad Dog   Click Here to Email Spanky the Mad Dog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Spanky here...

Yep and if you said the US is the best place to live I'm just going to belive you.

Hmm? Jerry or a world wide organization made up of a 188 countries?

I think I'll go with the UN.

Ya gotta love this tidbit too.

"While the United States has the world's highest gross national product, it ranks first in poverty rates among the 18 richest countries. "

"The main reason was the prevalence of functional illiteracy -- about one person in five -- the report said."

Hmm.. Considering that there is somewhere over 250 million people living down there, There is around 50 million dumbasses walking around.

about the war stuff. Your trying to combine the 2 seperate statements into one. WHY?

I said war was a waste of human life and money. AND that freedom is worth fighting for. Both can be true at the same time. I am very greatfull that the allies fought back during the second world war. BUT that doesn't mean the war wasn't a waste.

"Are you saying that Freedom is worth fighting for as long as it doesn't cost lives and money? " NOPE. you said that.

While I don't have a solution to all the worlds woes. At least I admit that war isn't the best one. You seem to stubborn or (some other choice words to admit it yourself.

As how people in Norway or Canada how they like their weather. I'm pretty sure they are fine with it. Your Idea and my idea are problably very different. Fact is even our summer is pretty damn hot. Fact is there is a desert in southern alberta. Fact is both Halifax and Vancouver harbors are open 365 days a year. Oh yeah, And I LIKE winter. I know that may be a little strange to you but yes people do like snow and cold weather.

About boat people. We pick them up off the coast of BC all the time. If your news covered more then the US maybe you would see that.

You #3s don't move cause its not a big jump. Course I'm American and I live in Canada so thats not always true.

The jump from #55 mexico to #3 US is a good jump. The extra couple thousand miles to get to #1 just isn't worth it. Specialy when you can buy all the papers you need on the streets of San Fransico.

"I guess we haven't read the UN report. LOL"

Well it could be that OR it could be that you CAN'T read. Remember that insanly high Functional Illiteracy, About 1 in 5.

[This message has been edited by Spanky the Mad Dog (edited 07-09-2000).]

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Tailslide
Pilot
posted 07-09- 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Tailslide   Click Here to Email Tailslide     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

Spanky, I'm also an American living in Canada and although I hate the cold weather I think its a great place to live.

Watch out though, nothing more dangerous than a cornered American with wounded pride

TS

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-09- 07:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Good response Spanky. Who wrote it for you?

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Falck
Pilot
posted 07-09- 08:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Falck   Click Here to Email Falck     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Canada does seem to be a nice place. Afterall, Niagra and Windsor both have great Casino's and are much closer than Vegas or Atlantic City. The only problem I had with it is taxes seemed outragiously high. I guess thats the price you pay when you want your goventment to provide health care and such.

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Spanky the Mad Dog
Pilot
posted 07-09- 08:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Spanky the Mad Dog   Click Here to Email Spanky the Mad Dog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Spanky here..

I wrote it Jerry, I was raised in Canada so I had a decent school system.

Yeah Falck the taxes are the worst part. But I do like free health care. Our taxes are dropping though.

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-10- 12:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Spanky,

Your first sentence was a run-on. Replace the comma with a period. Instead of "I had", try "I was exposed to a decent school system." Add a comma after 'Falck'.

And just think, I went to school in Texas, plus I'm going to college in Texas (again). It can't be that bad. Gee, no state income tax either.

LOL

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-10- 12:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"FREE" health care, what a joke. LOL

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Falck
Pilot
posted 07-10- 12:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Falck   Click Here to Email Falck     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Heres to states that dont have income tax.
Amen to that.

Now if we could just get rid of the IRS.

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Mk10 225th
Pilot
posted 07-10- 08:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mk10 225th   Click Here to Email Mk10 225th     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks guys. I was having a really rotten Monday morning, and you guys absolutely cracked me up.

I feel better now. I can meet the day, having had a good guffaw.

Mk10=225th=

P.S.: Dan, since when has Texas freely associated itself with the United States?

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Smokey
Pilot
posted 07-10- 09:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smokey   Click Here to Email Smokey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jerry,
You're right. It's much better the way we
(USA) do it. If they don't have the money
screw 'em they don't need to be healthy
anyway. You Republicans are all alike. It
amazes me that a country that will provide
you legal representation will not provide
you a free doctor.

[This message has been edited by Smokey (edited 07-10-2000).]

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Falck
Pilot
posted 07-10- 09:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Falck   Click Here to Email Falck     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Smokey,

What amazes me is that you feel that the government should be involved in the life of its citizens in every possible way. God knows that they're helpless on their own.

I'd much rather have to ability to make my own choices. The private sector can provide better service than the government simply because their survival depends on it.

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-10- 11:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Smokey, you missed my point, maybe the Canadian school system isn't so great after all. (The emphasis was on the word "FREE", the quotation marks and capitalization mean you are to stress that word.) It is not "free" unless the the Canadian doctors, hospitals and drug companies are donating their services. I doubt that even in Canada they are that selfless.

The tax payer is paying for it! Probably at inflated rates since it is run by the government! Maybe you and Spanky don't earn enough to pay taxes so to you it is free.

As far as the US not providing "free" doctors: did you know that no American hospital can turn anyone away for financial reasons? And that there are thousands of government and charity supported "free" clinics and "free" health programs in virtually all cities and counties for low income people?

You have fallen for the "big government is best" liberal press propaganda claiming millions of "uninsured" people. "Uninsured" only means they aren't covered by a health insurance policy. It does NOT mean that they don't have health care. I have never heard of anyone who died from lack of health care IF they sought it. And jobs with health care provided are going begging so there is no excuse for an able adult not to have health insurance.

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Jaguar
Pilot
posted 07-10- 02:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jaguar   Click Here to Email Jaguar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Spanky the Mad Dog:
Spanky here..
Our taxes are dropping though.

ROTFLOL! Ya, sure spanky ....... but on the bright side. I did just get over 300 bucks back from the government, so I can't complain.

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Jaguar
Pilot
posted 07-10- 02:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jaguar   Click Here to Email Jaguar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just checked the mail today, and I got a 50$ GST Check from the government! I LOVE THIS COUNTRY!!!!!

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-10- 04:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mk,

Well, unfortunately, it looks like our governor will soon be the President. So, I guess we better start associating with the rest of the country.

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-10- 05:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No no DanW, you have it backwards. After GW becomes President the rest of us will all become TEXANS! Yahoo!!!

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DanW
Pilot
posted 07-10- 07:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DanW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Are you sure you want that Jerry..?

George Jr. hasn't really did much of anything here in Texas. But, I guess some people see that as a good thing.

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Jerry
Pilot
posted 07-10- 08:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry   Click Here to Email Jerry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As long as he keeps his cigars to himself!

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Jaguar
Pilot
posted 07-10- 09:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jaguar   Click Here to Email Jaguar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ROTFLOL Jerry!

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