posted 04-25- 02:33 AM               

K i'm SOOOOOooooooo PISSED.

I'm trying to make a mission with 2 mossies bombing a town from 3000 feet with a heavy bomb load and 2000lbs of fuel.

so it all works out until it hits the bombing waypoint.

Its 6 miles long with it ending just after the town, .25 miles wide and 3000 feet high
the waypoints before and after it are perfectly in line and at the same speed (200) and alt just so theres no confusion in any turns before or after.
and there is no duration
So its all going good and then

So what does the AI do? opens the bay door GOOD.

Then it starts to lose it. Its start waverying side to side. more wild and more wild until its doing barrel rolls. AND its diving lower instead of staying up at 3000 like i told it.

WTF? it bombs at least it did that. And it almost hits but because its goign so wild they mostly miss.

and then even though theres no duration set (which in my mind means move on to next WP) they keep taking runs. Even the 2ND drops which is GOOD but he misses cause he's going crazy.

A couple time you here the good ol.

"bombs away"
but the AI is saying it so fast and repeating it about 20 times in 1 second that it comes out "BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBB"

again WTF

I'm lowing the fuel to 0 since most of the planes seem just fine like that and trying again

then if its still all mess i may widen the bombing run

then i will try the lanc or p38 instead.

all i know is this shouldn't be happening.

posted 04-25- 03:13 AM               

Ok i tried lower fuel and it still did barel rolls.

then i slapped in the P38s
and they kicked butt

they were on heavy bombing which was 2 bombs each. Not sure of the wieght

I had the target town set at 30%

they hit the bombing waypoint and for some reason dove to 2000Feet in a gentle glide. Oh well although i would like to know why.

Do all fighter bombers dive to 2000 Feet before droping? even if the waypoint says 3000 feet?

So anyways teh lead drops one bomb and hits. perfectly level no screwing around then he circles a bit and the 2nd drops one and hits. Awsome.

then the lead drops the other and hits. 30% damage done.

mission won come up.

and i sit there with a huge shit eating grin.

anyways.

so why the dive?

and WTF is up with the mossie guys? it needs to be looked at.

posted 04-25- 06:05 AM               

And it works great first time.

Then i add 2 jugs with rockets to take out the flak on another runway at the same feild.

Now everything is messed

the p38s air start adn the jugs won't use the runway i want thme to. Don;t i just ahve to put in the heading along the runway i want them to use as their start heading? it worked for the p38s but now not the jugs

on top of that the p38s go to the town and just keep flying

one jug goes right over the flak but won't attack and the other just takes off way before that.

The flak doesn't attack and the klaxon doesn't sound.

WTF.

I don't know how anyone gets any missions made with this somtimes.

posted 04-25- 07:18 AM               

1. I avoid the Jug offline. If you are flying it, its fine, AI only causes problems.
I have had CTD's, planes ignoring way points, and other little bugs when I subbed it in perfectly good missions. If you build a mission around the Jug it seems to work O.K.

2. I have noticed that when AI is on target in a bomb run AI picks the speed. Yes, occasionally it will lose a little alt., thats just how it goes. I don't often set AI to bomb below 4k as a safety measure. I used to but I was losing to many planes in the blast.

3. I've never encountered the mossie problem.
Then again I don't use it that often. I checked my Mossie missions and they are fine.

4. The P-38's are great under AI. They bomb and sweep very well. The glide thing is just how they work. It does leave them kinda vulnerable.

5. Not all fields will let you launch more than one squadron. Which one are you flying out of?

6. Try half a mile on the width of the bomb run. That always works well for me.

posted 04-25- 07:57 AM               

I'm flying from eastbourn air base. Is that one a problem one?

I just changed the runway to another and i'm goign to try again

I changed to typoons and they seem to work better

Then lead tried to attack the flak but all the rockets fell short by a long shot.

I'm not sure if he was attacking the town in front of it or not. Will they do that on sweep?

Anyway i changed runways and set a hopefully better course for the typoons and hopefully it will work out.

If anyone knows any air feilds that are problems with multiple squads PLEASE LET ME KNOW.

Thanks alot for the help man.

posted 04-25- 08:00 AM               

Yep just tried another runway and the typoons (and the jugs) keep stealling the runway i set for the p38s so the p38s air start.

posted 04-25- 09:19 AM               

I just cannot get the typhoons to attack the flak. And for some reason the p38s arn't attack right anymore.

posted 04-25- 11:42 AM               

The mission editor and maybe the whole game.

A mission i ran earlier today used to run fine.

Both P38s would take turns droping bombs on the town till it hit 30%

Now only one drops and the other one comes in all off course and climbs to 5000 feet when the way points are set at 3000 feet.

So now i had to drop my target % down to 20% cause thats all one P38 can do.

THen i try to put in typhoons to take out the flak and they never hit the flak with their rockets

They are on rockets, they have high everything with regular sanity.

They have a sweep run that confines them to the flak.

The first one sees it as a target and lines up and fires but can never hit.

And its not on the side of a mountain or nothing its right out at the edge of the water.

Why do missions play different depending on what time of day i happen to want to play.

Last night they were bombing great now they don't and the typhoons can't hit nothing.

I don't want someone to fix it for me mposis thanks for the offer though.

I need someone to tell me whats wrong IF anything besides the mission editor and AI are crap.

If you want to look at the mission get it here.
www.thot.net/~verge/showoff/simple3.mis

Thanks for any help.

posted 04-25- 12:52 PM               

I have deepest sympathy. The missions editor has always been erratic, but it gets more and more cantankerous. I converted a Typhoon mission to a Jug mission and, in ground pounder mode, the Jug can devastate half an airfield with loosely aimed bombs. The mission objective is three Me262s on the ground which is quite hard with rocket armed Tiffies but dead easy with bomb armed Jugs. I get the win message but no credit for the Me262s, just hatfuls of hangars, barracks, etc etc.

As regards the flak/klaxon it again seems erratic but, to the game's credit, it is less likely to respond the lower you go in. In other words, it allows for surprise. The trouble is if you go in low in the Jug, you blow yourself to glory.

I don't suppose the mission editor has any random factor built in?

Mr B

PS the AI can't hit shit with the rockets. In the end, you have to do it all yourself, jumping from plane to plane. The AI ain't much of a friend, but is a bitch of an enemy. Have you ever seen enemy AI miss its bombing target on the first run?

posted 04-25- 12:59 PM            

Runways:

Spanky, try changing the heading of the second squad (if the one suggested by Pete's map doesn't work then increase the difference between the 1st squad's heading and the 2nd). No guarantees here.

On the Jug, I haven't tried many missions with it - sounds like some people have experienced problems.

posted 04-25- 02:24 PM               

thanks for the tips guys. I guess will just have somthign bomb those flak.

So I can saftly say that the AI just can't use rockets effectively?

Everyone agrees witht that statement?

Siggi- You may be right and there is practically no chance of the situation getting any better. BUT what should i play for a ww2 flight sim then?

If i don't like eaw, CFS, Janes ww2 or the online only stuff? What should i play.

I like SDOE so i play it. Yes i'm a sucker for punishment. YOu should have seen how pissed i was last night.

When i know there is a known bug or flaw i don't mind working around it. its when i don't know that and somthing refuses to work that i start to lose it.

posted 04-25- 02:43 PM               

I can't count the number of times B-17II has been delayed and the release date pushed back-- and I truly hope for you and for Pops and Enthor and all those that have left for bigger and better things- that it does materialize. As much as I admire you guys for your resiliance, I can't spend my days like that. When B17II and FC:TOE or whatever it is come out-- I will be the first around here to buy it...but in the meantime-- I can recreate any aerial battle in WWI and WWII (and possible current time) that I want to fly...it takes some time, patience, and a lot of tweaking- but when I'm done-- I get lots of satisfaction out of it.

So Spanky-- yes it's frustrating- just like modeling a plane can be. It isn't so easy to make those campaigns, eh? Maybe now we'll get some recognition LOL...but it is worthwhile to me- and I'll probably still be fiddling with it long after everyone here is gone. I hope you guys find that pot o' gold at the end of the rainbow...but I can't sit around on my brain waiting for it-- I'll just have fun here until then.

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Brought to you by the campaign for a better Dauntless!

posted 04-25- 02:50 PM               

So Jeeves would you agree that he AI can't do succesfull rocket attacks? If you have pulled it off do you have any tips.

Just wait till i get to the point that i want aircraft attacking eash other. Then we shall see pissed.

posted 04-25- 02:53 PM               

As far as I know, the AI does fire rockets in the BetaBuild65-- but how effectively I don't know. I have never seen the AI fire rockets- only drop them when entering a dogfight. Basically-- the AI in most of the new planes pretty much sucks! But-- as I've said-- if you tweak, and tweak, and tweak some more-- you can usually get them to work. I hear you Spanky-- I get frustrated at times- I'm at present PO'd at the Lancs- I have them in a mission to bomb the Lys Dam with the Tallboy bomb-- and it just flies over and opens and closes the bay doors. I have tried changing the mission from night to day, tried changing the loadouts, tried placing a flak gun near the dam and renaming it to Lys Dam, tried changing the bomb run distances- I have tried every trick I have learned-- and it still just opens and closes the doors.

It hasn't always been this hard though-- with all the changes to the game with new airfoils, new startup ppf's, the Nations project (which kills me to say as I am a co-coordinator), and all the messing around here and there- it seems that the AI has lost a hell of a lot of IQ-- it's like a retarded stepchild as of late. This is what needs to be addressed-- the AI. When that is fixed, maybe it'll get easier to create, but until then- tweak, tweak, tweak (did I just say that?)

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Brought to you by the campaign for a better Dauntless!

posted 04-25- 05:37 PM               

Thanks for the info jeeves. Even an old pro is having problems. I don't think the AI will get fixed until more people get into making good missions.

Siggi. Yeah i'm mad at SDOE latly but its mostly cause of the AI and making missions. I still love flying online. So as long as I stick to that its all cool.

posted 04-26- 10:45 AM               

Jv44~Siggi- I must say I belive there is no way that any add ons could have corrupted your lan-online stuff.

mposis- Ok i will avoid useing rockets with the AI, I will make them bomb but give them a bomb+rockets loadout for humans.

posted 04-26- 12:40 PM               

Can you send me your missions too?

posted 04-26- 01:15 PM               

Yes i do think its a Coincidence. Odds are for it. What woudl be in any planes that would do somthign like that? Nothing that i can think of. AND why woudl it only happen to u?

posted 04-26- 03:12 PM               

Spanky....who you calling an "old pro"? Why I oughta...

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Brought to you by the campaign for a better Dauntless!

posted 04-26- 05:07 PM               

K Siggi what exactly would you like to see fixed in SDOE to make it more viable for an online Squad based combat sim?

I'm just wondering. ONLY bugs please.

posted 04-26- 05:41 PM               

B17-2
CFS-2
Ils
BoB

posted 04-26- 06:36 PM               

Ok siggi. I get ya now.

Although I don't think the pick any plane in lobby is so good. IF your supposed to be a squad then you would in almost all cases have the same planes. If it was mercenarys in the sky, then I can see picking any plane you want.

We don't want to turn SDOE in furball central. I don't just want another WB or AW here. It should be a mission based game like it is.

So you just want a game where 5 guys take on 5 guys in a big furball with there choice of planes? Thats no fun too me. and theres lots of games that already do it. Including SDOE.

Just get the dynamic mission creator. It will spit you out a mission with any planes you want in oh about 5 seconds.

Really its that fast. no using the mission editor.

I also don't see the need for a bigger map for this. WHY? if your not doing any bombing runs?

I tried a BOB demo or beta and it sucked ass. Perfectly straight shorlines.

I know your waiting for good ol b17. BUT what do you play now? Ya mine as well fly something. maybe aces high free 8 player is more your style?

I can't just sit and WAIT for a game to come out. I need somthing i can play now. That happens to be SDOE.

I think you sound more like an online pay to play kinda guy.

are you also looking for kill boards and all that jazz?

me i have no use for kill boards. I don't care if my name is in the top ten, nor do i need to look at it to tell who the good pilots are.

posted 04-26- 09:22 PM               

I think you sound like a guy who should get into WW2 online then man.

I know you say your not a furballer but what would you do in this game except fight other fighters?

Why would anyone be in a bomber in that game? whats to bomb?

Tail- well one of them sucked anyway. The FM can be the best there is but i'm not interested if they ignore the rest of the game.

posted 04-26- 11:26 PM               

Actually man. I would RATHER take out bombers. then dogfight.

I find it great fun.

Why do you say ww2 online looks crude as hell? I think its not as much eye candy as B17-2 but its an online sim. Remember Eye candy doesn't make the game. Gameplay does.

Plus have you heard about the engine modeling in ww2 online? INSANE.

have you heard about the sound engine? You can set the distance your "virtual ears" are apart in the game for better sound tunning.

They seem to pay close attention to detail.

plus its a real war with real supply lines and with the air force working WITH the navy and army.

IF that squad of tanks takes out that ammo dump below you it WILL effect your squad if that was YOUR ammo dump.